What if the Rapture Window theory goes Belly up?

[TCC]

Excellent video @1LoverofGod. Really great stuff. It is actually edifying when we engage with concerns like this we may have. Back in 2017 I thought the rapture year would be 2024/2025 ish. So we might be close. I believe in the 6k year rule too. But what if the year church rapture mirrors is Christ's resurrection? Then 33 AD might be a mirror of the rapture. Not the start of the new millennial age. That is "a way" to think about it too. So if no rapture in 2025 or 2026, no worries. We have until 2033...its all good...lol.

Where do we place the tribulation? Is it a part of the age of grace....just the very last part? Or is it part of the "Day of the Lord?" Which seems to stray even into the 1.000 year reign language. If its the latter days of the age of grace then 2033 could very well be a rapture year. If its considered "Day of the Lord" proper, then it would be the first 7 years of the Day of the Lord + 1k. At least it would seem to include the Millennial kingdom. We don't hear much about that. But seems to be the case potentially according to 1 Peter 3:10-13 indicating that the Day of the Lord will include the destruction of the present heavens and earth and the creation of the new heavens and new earth. Tribulation night, to end of the 1k year age = darkness again--then God reorders the heavens and earth. So its like 1k years is like a day to the Lord. With books ends on each side of it (tribulation/Satan Released). So this is a possibility, I believe.

I believe things being so much like they are right now with apocalypse on many minds (even Trump is saying "apocalyptic fires" in California--yes...its just dramatic Trump...for CA seems to always have apocalyptic fires lately--over passed few years, once the winds kick in). I believe America can be considered a harbinger. Although i don't use that term. Look Iran calls America the Great Satan and Israel the little Satan. By their own prophets (tongue-m-cheek) they line America up with Israel. George Washington wanted America to be a persecution free zone for Jews in diaspora around the world. I believe the interest in Freemasonry and America gets more press though than that.

Plus something super huge that transcends Jonathan Cahn. The constitution. Aside from my first seal issue that i have...lol...the constitution is like no other government. There is no other government that says we get our rights from God. None. Except for Israel's theocracy in the OT. So it would not be rocket science, to me, or even sensationalism to do the following:

• America seems like it could stand for representationally "The Gentile Age/The Church Age." If aliens from another planet came to earth and said "Take me to you leader," i believe American presidency is considered the most powerful position on earth because no other country has had such economic super force and military force where it had been considered to police the whole world.
• In the watcher world we have become so used to downplaying America (because of how obvious it would seem she fits into prophecy) and have to downsize her because perhaps prophecy grants us deeper views that ordinary powerful America (that is too easy--only the Jr. High level peeps believe that). Plus come on, Trump? America cannot be prophetic. Even though Trump affirmed Jerusalem and Golan Heights (the rocky mountain area for which without being owned by Israel Ez 38 could not happen--of which Trump affirmed by tweet to take back Golan Heights on Purim). Still, nahh, Trump is Maga, Qanon, and Mammon. Nothing good comes out of Nazareth. Yeah i said that...lol.
• America is about to go postal on the world...with the Postmaster lol
• On a personal note, i believe Daniel's Lion animal with wings lost standing up like a man is America (coming from England's Lion national animal, forming democracy--heart like a man--out of the Kings and Queens era). King Nebuchadnezzar was already dead when Daniel had that prophecy. And the lion appears in Rev 13.
• So i no its not watcher fashionable to believe America might be in prophecy, i think it is super related because of a no brainer. America has been protecting Israel for almost 80 years now. I think its ok to assume they might keep doing that for a while. Especially with Trump's loud language about coming down hard if the hostages are not returned.

I also believe that America becomes Babylon the great in the tribulation. But I guess we won't see due to the rapture. But we will from heaven. So in that way we will see. Although i would say that Noam Saudi Arabia has something like 1/4 of the worlds resources working on it right now. So yeah...maybe that's the new Babylon. Nothing else like it. So i say all the above about America so i can say this and it not sound like soup for brains: In 2026 Trump wants to have the 250th year anniversary of America as a very special July 4th 2026. With a garden of heroes. It sounds like Trump would like to have a lot of things under his belt by then. So i guess we should see pretty early on how serious he might be about being anti-globalism.

But that looks like an interesting year to consider for rapture. This will be a hard statement for some. And of course it is just musing over things, but if America represents the world leading nation of gentiles in an age the defends Israel, the contrast of Jew/Gentile--ishness is already in the cue for us. It would make sense that things like Q might detour us from taking America seriously. Exactly. I would not be surprised if the rapture is on July 4th 2026. Not because of Trump. Not because of America, but because of the constitution saying we get our rights from God--and she was the main defender of Israel for almost a century. To me, that provides context to the age of grace in a governmental statement that if we could view this outside our social moment could look like something.

These are just ponderings. And i do believe the rapture could come as late as 2033. But if we are still here past 2026, I'd be surprised. I don't think the church witnesses Ez 38. And as that comes more in alignment, i believe Ez 38 might be a compass for the rapture--a possibility. If so, and Saudi normalizes soon, I'd think 2026 looks like a reasonable year possibility. Blessings.

​

 

[Andy C]

also believe that America becomes Babylon the great in the tribulation.

Babylon is mentioned 252 times in the Bible. Can you show me a single time the name Babylon was used when it was not referencing the actual city of Babylon?

 

[Cheeky200386]

Babylon is mentioned 252 times in the Bible. Can you show me a single time the name Babylon was used when it was not referencing the actual city of Babylon?

I believe Babylon in Revelation is the literal Babylon as Andy Woods does.

 

[LightOfMyLife]

High five
I feel the same way.
I wouldn't like to be under the stress of looking at a set timeframe and if that time frame passes oh what a disappointment and then to do it all over again with another set timeframe based on human calculation and estimation, and again raising up my hopes and if it once again fails, it can be devastating especially if I'm set on getting out of here only to find I missed the plane again. I too am satisfied with knowing God has His appointed time and He will get us home, not too soon and not too late, but just at the right time as He waits in Long suffering for more to repent and come to Christ Jesus and be saved. 2 Peter 3:9

It doesn't shake my faith on what God's word says which is truth. The will take place in Gods timing.

 

[TCC]

WhBabylon is mentioned 252 times in the Bible. Can you show me a single time the name Babylon was used when it was not referencing the actual city of Babylon?

Mystery Babylon though is by nature on the surface letting us know it is likely answering your question though brother.

Revelation 17:5 Commentaries: and on her forehead a name was written, a mystery, "BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND OF THE ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH."

I don't always go with commentaries. There are always takes i don't subscribe to. But i do consult Bible Hub as a source having relevance. Perhaps not here. But I have come across other takes in Bible Hub that can be quite helpful. So in the batch of commentary, not one of them thinks "mystery Babylon" means Babylon. Not one. I know Andy Woods and David Jeremiah believe it is the Babylon of old that is revived. With Andy a lot of this sort of thing for him has seemed to rest on the woman in the basket. But there are some commentaries (and in this case a very rare time i actually read Matthew Henry) that Henry's observation of the woman in the basket (from Zechariah) is not Babylon rebuilt. Its Israel scattered in diaspora building houses. And as i test this notion Henry is not alone. And it brings to me the most contextual sense.

I appreciate your defense of standing for the word. I always have. Some of your posts in our forum have been most interesting and I consider you brother one of the more staple family members in our forum. There have been a number of times I have cherished your zeal. And the things you care to speak on. Amen. On this one, though, we may not share like mindedness on what is meant by Babylon. One reason here, for me, would be that i not think that perhaps the best way to sort out what Babylon might mean in Mystery Babylon would be to take an approach of what it means everywhere else. Because clearly "mystery" is added to it. And scholars tend to think it may not mean what we might put on it, but it does mean something in addition to the name Babylon. The consensus seems to be that "mystery" makes it symbolic. So where there is (a) that "mystery" existing, we can't really also use it--having not be fully revealed yet, as something to affirm it is Babylon the ancient city location. In addition, there are aspects in Jeremiah's later chapters where some scholars (or many) believe have not been yet fulfilled but perhaps likely they are to be fulfilled in Mystery Babylon. So if we cannot prove that today, it's not altogether in my mind the best approach to scriptural discernment to use somewhat outlier details to suggest later Jeremiah is not talking (in part) about mystery Babylon. In other words we can't prove it is always Babylon in Jeremiah if there are yet prophesies still concerning her to be fulfilled. If that is to be literal Babylon, we don't have that city back to look for that. So to me that is almost akin to an argument maybe from silence. Where the thing that is clear is that it is not completely settled as clear. Those things, in my understanding, would not be the best framework by which to build convictions on though as far as i can tell.

. . . . .

Enduring Word Commentary 1 Peter 5:15

c. She who is in Babylon… greets you: She probably refers to the church, which in the ancient Greek is in the feminine. Peter apparently wrote from Babylon. This may be the literal city of Babylon (which still existed in Peter’s day), or it may be a symbolic way of referring to either Rome or Jerusalem. These were two cities that in Peter’s day were famous for their wickedness and spiritual rebellion, just like ancient Babylon was. In any regard, this was one church greeting another.

i. There was of course the literal city of Babylon on the Euphrates. There was also a place known as Babylon in Egypt, and it was a Roman military fortress near the present city of Cairo. Yet many think that Peter meant “Babylon” in a symbolic sense to represent the city of Rome. As a Biblical concept, “Babylon” as the city of this world stands in contrast to “Jerusalem” as the city of God. He may have meant Rome as Babylon as “the center of worldliness.”

i. “It should be noted that the apostles did not originate that form of greeting; the custom already prevailed. They sanctioned its use as a sincere expression of Christian love.” (Hiebert)

. . . . .

I just wanted to share 1 commentary view on 1 Peter 5:15 to express that varying commentaries will handle this differently. But there is enough of a question as to whether or not this meant literal Babylon or was merely symbolic. In any event it points to a good reference in Rev 11:18 as an example of the powerful driving force of symbolism in Revelation. It is also I think good to note that Revelation is known hugely for symbology. Obviously futurists like us who see a coming tribulation and pretrib rapture don't see Revelation as analogy. But literal. However, even in our literal stance, we are aware the book of Revelation uses symbology. To best determine how is the duty of kings (searching out a matter). So it does take effort to discern the level of symbology going on in Revelation. We may hold differing views, but one that is fairly accepted across the board is that Revelation does use symbolism. And it is known for that. So if a book known for symbolism also uses the concept of "mystery" to describe Babylon, we are looking at:

a) a symbolic book -- a book known for symbolism, &
b) a name associated with Babylon defined as mystery (quite often understood as symbolism)

So we have a symbolic book to an extent providing a symbolic looking reference to Babylon. To me, this suggests double symbolism power and/or potential. It may not mean what i think it might. Could it mean some mystery about a literal reconstituted Babylon? I believe brother it could. But the odds are against it on its face, i would say. Because of it being symbolic book itself and using symbolism too regarding Babylon specifically.

So I would look at all these factors and see there has been a rebuilt Israel for almost 80 years. But there has not be a rebuilt Babylon for any years. I have included a recent video update as to future potential building out of Babylon. It would be interesting if this actually does lead to a revival of the city. It certainly is note worthy to look into and consider. And its trade route location, attention, and wealth building aiming partners (like China) make Babylon in Iraq great again. But even if there is some level of Babylon revived as some future point, it could imply more literal stances biblically used, but it does not have to mean it becomes Babylon the Great. But I will say quite endearing a quality to be charmed by this video. As i mentioned before I would see the schematic of Zachariah's 8 visions parse the woman in the basket very differently. I would also note from this video that i don't think NYC is Babylon. You can see references in Jeremiah when it appears Babylon is related to a city. And sometimes it refers to it as bigger than a city. Like a kingdom or empire. Which is the sense in why there might be some measure of permission to overlay that perhaps over the whole USA...not just New York. Me things. Blessings.

- YouTube

Enjoy the videos and music you love, upload original content, and share it all with friends, family, and the world on YouTube.

www.youtube.com

PS -- There was a back and forth I did on JDF where one of the members there saw "Daughter of Babylon" as different than Babylon proper. And the brother had some good points. Enough for me to consider it might be a thing. In his view of that he held America is the Daughter of Babylon possibly. Seeing some prophesies in Jeremiah that mirrored some current events in America. One being that as Trump takes the presidency he gets taken down. Normally i don't come close to any ideas like that. For me if America is Bab the Great it would "become' that in the tribulation. Not that it is that, now. But this brother brought something to my attention I never saw before. And it put me into a horror movie...lol. But after looking at it closer the said prophecies that match current events seemed to very much have been fulfilled in Jeremiah already. Leaving me to believe it was not something having too much weight toward our current climate.

As a rule, there are many who use youtube to say, "Come out of her my children," as meaning the USA because it will get EMPed or something. Those to me are fantastical and clickbait fringe. I don't believe under any circumstances that America is Bab the Great now. I see that as a later 1st half trib development. But yeah i guess if Trump gets struck down at the inauguration, you heard it first here...lol. But i have more stock in my 1st seal view which is nothing like that. Hey so in that video the content creator mentions the Andy Woods stance of 1st seal Covenant with the Many...and 2nd Seal, Ez 38. I believe the second part of that is likely accurate. But i don't believe it makes any sense for Ez 38 to result from the deal with the many. Especially if AC makes a covenant for 7 years and breaks it at the midpoint. Not at the beginning. Blessings again.

 

[TCC]

Babylon is mentioned 252 times in the Bible. Can you show me a single time the name Babylon was used when it was not referencing the actual city of Babylon?

I believe what i posted earlier might more comprehensively address your question. But as a specific answer, here are two verses that inform us of Babylon as Babylonia the empire, having many cities (not just the city called Babylon) under her reign: Jeremiah 50:32 & 51:43. Blessings.

 

[Andy C]

I believe what i posted earlier might more comprehensively address your question. But as a specific answer, here are two verses that inform us of Babylon as Babylonia the empire, having many cities (not just the city called Babylon) under her reign: Jeremiah 50:32 & 51:43. Blessings.

IMO, that’s a stretch of the verses meaning.

 

[Amethyst]

Lee has also done well to bring out a video like this as a lot of the pre trib channels out there are all pretty much hyping up this 2 year rapture window.

It sounds exciting, even very plausible, but oh boy the comedown that would occur if the rapture didn't occur within the next 2 years woukd probably destroy a lot of people's hopes.

It remained more hopeful for me when less people were talking about it.
Then all kinds of dumb sensational stuff started happening with it.

That guy Tyler did another video with Pete Garcia and was correlating 'last trump' with "Trump-Pence" aka "trumpets" and then said how eerily close "Trump-Vance" is also to 'trumpets." No it isn't. That sounds absolutely ridiculous.
I felt like it was making a mockery of the theory, which seems sensible/plausible. But when people start grasping foolish straws out of thin air, it makes us all look so foolish.

 

[Cheeky200386]

It remained more hopeful for me when less people were talking about it.
Then all kinds of dumb sensational stuff started happening with it.

That guy Tyler did another video with Pete Garcia and was correlating 'last trump' with "Trump-Pence" aka "trumpets" and then said how eerily close "Trump-Vance" is the 'trumpets." No it isn't. That sounds absolutely ridiculous.
I felt like it was making a mockery of the theory, which seems sensible/plausible. But when people start grasping foolish straws out of thin air, it makes us all look so foolish.

I’ve heard this theory too but seeing you spell out the words and how they make Trumpets made me chuckle. Hey, you never know but it does sound silly reading it out loud.

 

[Hol]

"Although the laws of shemittah are observed in Israel to this very day,

This is new info to me.

Israel (Judah) went into captivity to Babylon for not allowing the land to rest.

I wonder if they hire gentiles to work the land every seventh year in modern day Israel?

 

[Amethyst]

I’ve heard this theory too but seeing you spell out the words and how they make Trumpets made me chuckle. Hey, you never know but it does sound silly reading it out loud.

The 'last Trump' thing to me was always ok, because, how many people do you know named Trump, anyway? And it's nice to think about.
But tacking on all the other stuff with a straight face, ugh.

 

[Margery]

This is new info to me.

Israel (Judah) went into captivity to Babylon for not allowing the land to rest.

I wonder if they hire gentiles to work the land every seventh year in modern day Israel?

I was quoting from a Jewish site which is ultra orthodox (Chabad). They don't feel the current Sanhedrin is qualified, and their strict members (a small portion of the Jews in Israel) actually do use Arab farms to buy food from during the Shemitah year. It was interesting seeing their take. I did that because our ideas or J.Cahn's ideas of Shemittah or Jubilee might vary a bit depending on who you talk to, where they calculate from etc.

The Essene Calendar stuff predates the Christian era by 200 years, so it's actually a very good source to actually determine what year the next Jubilee is. The Rabbinic Judaic site Chabad and other Rabbinic sources are pretty much in line with the Pharisee branch of Judaism. They differ from the Essenes who were alive and well at the time of Christ and a couple of hundred years before that- arising in the Maccabee period after the return of some of the Jews from Babylon to rebuild. There are 3 big divisions in Judaism at the time of Christ: Pharisees, Sadducees and Essenes. A lot of Essenes simply folded into Christianity when Christ appeared, and even more after his death, resurrection and ascension. The few who didn't drifted into weird cults and petered out.

It remained more hopeful for me when less people were talking about it.
Then all kinds of dumb sensational stuff started happening with it.

That guy Tyler did another video with Pete Garcia and was correlating 'last trump' with "Trump-Pence" aka "trumpets" and then said how eerily close "Trump-Vance" is also to 'trumpets." No it isn't. That sounds absolutely ridiculous.
I felt like it was making a mockery of the theory, which seems sensible/plausible. But when people start grasping foolish straws out of thin air, it makes us all look so foolish.

The 'last Trump' thing to me was always ok, because, how many people do you know named Trump, anyway? And it's nice to think about.
But tacking on all the other stuff with a straight face, ugh.

100% agree! And that is why I'm not a Tyler fan. He goes a little overboard into the silly stuff in my opinion.

Lee Brainard did a really good job of balancing everything out - in that video that Rose posted in the OP.

 

[Amethyst]

Lee Brainard did a really good job of balancing everything out - in that video that Rose posted in the OP.

I think his video was more of a "stop thinking it's going to happen in 2 years, because it's probably not. Convergence has been happening since the 1600s"

 

[Margery]

I think his video was more of a "stop thinking it's going to happen in 2 years, because it's probably not. Convergence has been happening since the 1600s"

True, that too!

 

[mattfivefour]

Regardless of what theories man comes up with, while they may look interesting if they do not come to pass makes no difference to me in the least. And I never suffer disappointment from their failure to occur. The Rapture will happen when it will happen. And I will be shocked and absolutely delighted when it does. Even so, come, Lord Jesus.

 

[TCC]

IMO, that’s a stretch of the verses meaninge

That Babylon was not an empire, Babylonia? Or that under its rule were many cities? I believe by stretch you mean seeing that Babylonia is an empire governing many cities is not the same as to what a future Babylon could be, as the stretch. And I understand and agree that could be stretch. But on the merits, i just brought it up because having looked into this over the past 7 years, the arguments of why America could not be Mystery Babylon would be because America is not a city primarily. So I think that is why some go with NYC, because it houses the UN too.

The way i tend to resolve it is quite unconventional. Admittedly, i may well be wrong. In fact it would be kind of exciting to see i might if during our lifetime Babylon gets rebuilt with consequence. There i would happily surrender any other view that would not mean a future Babylon in Iraq. With awe and amazement I would. But what stands out on the side lines beyond the average debates is that mirror concept prophecy tends to have. Or in some cases even it would seem that prophecy in Israeli concept is somewhat repetitive or discoverable by early fulfillments pointing to greater ones. For that would surely seem to have to be the case in every one of the holy days. So in that kind of hue overlayed upon a future Babylon, we are told this harlot nation, city, empire of sorts, will be hated by the confederacy. That is a future condition and element in Revelation. Something we don't think all that much about. But reflective of that, just in theory of course, is that America is pretty well the country the world (UN) loves to hate (next to Isreal). So in one sense, America already potentially carries a potential element of future prophetic Babylonian baggage perhaps.

If "stretch" be a sincere concern, and i believe your point is valid in doing so, my reply there would not be to minimize your concern. For i believe there is room to see stretch on the merits. Amen. But if we look at the woman in the basket in Zechariah and don't see a potential stretch in landing on that strongly as a future Babylon, I would wonder why "stretch" might not also apply there. I understand why Andy Woods sees that. Or other commentaries too. But there are quite a number of scholars that would see the potential for the following:

a) Shinar could be symbolic of equating Israel's behavior with that land of Nimrod, and
b) Temple could well simply translate as houses or dwellings of Israel

If the above is the case, lets say, then we have God prophesying about Israel in their return to building their temple on the eve of a soon coming Messiah by which their nation will disown. And God using Zechairah in this post exilic way to inform Israel from His sovereign perspective the severity of forsaking their messiah. In the story of Israel having been captured by Babylon, then rescue by Cyrus, God also inform Israel that they will at a later point not just be grounded from their land for 70 years. But 2,000. When looking at God's covenant relationship with Isreal, the context they found themselves in, and the value of prophesy being so Israeli centric...since the diaspora happened, and since 2000 years is a lot more than 70, and how well that version of the women in the basket fits the surrounding imports of the other 7 visions Zechariah has, it seem far more fitting that the woman in the basket is referring to Israel. Not Babylon...the one that they just got freed from.

From our Western perspectives, it might be more juicy to see a future Babylon because of the picturesque imports it helps line up for us such a colorfully horrific tribulation period to come. But I would submit in contrast to that, that the massive break from Old Testament to New Testament highlighting a super massive shift from Jewish use of God to Gentile use of God...has a bit more dynamite in the woman in the basket meaning pertain to Israel. From an historical perspective. From a covenantal perspective. And from a passionate heart of God displayed toward Israel historically for 1500 years toward them we have seen perspective. All of those lined up together much more severely seem to suggest the woman in the basket is likely not Babylon. But quite a stretch beyond the otherwise nuclear bomb depth the woman in the basket being Israel suggests in those visions.

But I've never heard Andy Woods even believe there is a view that is not a Babylonian temple. Which is fine as odds seem to go today. But in todays market where we have seen on youtube that hot and colorful views make impressions, I guess i am not completely surprised. But as it goes, I really do love Andy Woods and adore most of his teachings. With a few I really don't. But it would just be good i think in our day for those that have huge platforms to show strengths and weaknesses of our own views. And the potential strengths of those views we don't hold. That would be a great teaching and body of Chrsit empathy tool. But instead we get more like the digging in the heels in dirt versions of why our views are likely the stellar ones to go with. I'm not saying Andy Woods does this on purpose. It is kind of cultural in general. But if we are going to see relevance in "stretch," i believe with all the interpretational difficulty in Zechariah ( a book some would see as even more nuanced than Revelation), along with the presentational potential inconsistencies (not permitting other scholarship to be reasonably considered when it is so richly and plentifully available), it would seem to me the woman in the basket as a camp to land on for future Babylon is a super stretch--when compared to a minor city/cities challenge. IMHO. Blessings.

 

[Spartan Sprinter]

It remained more hopeful for me when less people were talking about it.
Then all kinds of dumb sensational stuff started happening with it.

That guy Tyler did another video with Pete Garcia and was correlating 'last trump' with "Trump-Pence" aka "trumpets" and then said how eerily close "Trump-Vance" is also to 'trumpets." No it isn't. That sounds absolutely ridiculous.
I felt like it was making a mockery of the theory, which seems sensible/plausible. But when people start grasping foolish straws out of thin air, it makes us all look so foolish.

Yeah i hate those "coincidences" too in relation to the Trunp stuff

 

[Spartan Sprinter]

I was quoting from a Jewish site which is ultra orthodox (Chabad). They don't feel the current Sanhedrin is qualified, and their strict members (a small portion of the Jews in Israel) actually do use Arab farms to buy food from during the Shemitah year. It was interesting seeing their take. I did that because our ideas or J.Cahn's ideas of Shemittah or Jubilee might vary a bit depending on who you talk to, where they calculate from etc.

The Essene Calendar stuff predates the Christian era by 200 years, so it's actually a very good source to actually determine what year the next Jubilee is. The Rabbinic Judaic site Chabad and other Rabbinic sources are pretty much in line with the Pharisee branch of Judaism. They differ from the Essenes who were alive and well at the time of Christ and a couple of hundred years before that- arising in the Maccabee period after the return of some of the Jews from Babylon to rebuild. There are 3 big divisions in Judaism at the time of Christ: Pharisees, Sadducees and Essenes. A lot of Essenes simply folded into Christianity when Christ appeared, and even more after his death, resurrection and ascension. The few who didn't drifted into weird cults and petered out.



100% agree! And that is why I'm not a Tyler fan. He goes a little overboard into the silly stuff in my opinion.

Lee Brainard did a really good job of balancing everything out - in that video that Rose posted in the OP.

Lol tyler needs a collab video with Lee so Lee can just pour water all over his fires when he starts talking you know what

 

[Spartan Sprinter]

It remained more hopeful for me when less people were talking about it.
Then all kinds of dumb sensational stuff started happening with it.

That guy Tyler did another video with Pete Garcia and was correlating 'last trump' with "Trump-Pence" aka "trumpets" and then said how eerily close "Trump-Vance" is also to 'trumpets." No it isn't. That sounds absolutely ridiculous.
I felt like it was making a mockery of the theory, which seems sensible/plausible. But when people start grasping foolish straws out of thin air, it makes us all look so foolish.

I kinda feel the same, the more people think the rapture is going to occur its almost guranteed to not be the date or rough timeframe that it's likely to occur

 

[Margery]

Lol tyler needs a collab video with Lee so Lee can just pour water all over his fires when he starts talking you know what

Tyler and Lee parted ways. They were good friends but Tyler took exception when Lee posted a video about 18 months ago just around the time Tyler posted a video collaborating with Dr Barry Awe who at the time was getting all excited about Aug of 23 being a "high watch" for sure it's gonna happen date, complete with some weird stuff about a completely new date for Pentecost in late summer as the feast of New Wine.

Lee wasn't aiming it specifically at Barry Awe but he was dealing with the uptick of date setting and did call out the whole Pentecost isn't Pentecost, in late spring anymore but being as Barry parked it - in late summer.

Tyler got mad, his followers really got mad and Lee was shut out. Pete Garcia didn't dump Lee and quite a few good prophecy teachers took notice of Lee so it all worked out for Lee.

But I've always thought Lee's warnings would have been really good for Tyler, providing a better balance for his teachings. Tyler was working well with Pete Garcia and still is, but he has gone more towards the extremes of Dr Barry Awe, Scarborough and that other guy that I can't remember.