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How Close Are We to the Rapture?
- Thread starter StaceyLovesJesus
- Start date
TCC
Well-known
Hi brother Andy. I know of a dear sister that used to be a long standing member of JDF a while back. And during her long stretch of posting regularly on that forum she was deeply passionate about what was going on in our day. I still correspond with her in email even though she is not on any end time forum. This is from her growing perspective on a gap theory. She leans more so to 'years" in between now. Not giving much thought anymore to end times because her perspective has become such that to her it could be even another 10 to 20 years. In her case it would seem that her view on gap theory has refocused her to consider how to assess current end time posture. She shared with me some good articles on the issue. And although they are convincing to consider, I don't really hold too much toward it. My reasoning though is seemingly more subjective than objective. But where it is objective, i believe it is for cause though.
What I mean is that I can totally understand how understanding a gap theory takes is reaonsable because of an otherwise trend of shoehorning in our views to force an interpretation. And in that way, I can appreciate the consideration. Because I do believe there is quite a bit of shoehorning going on. Perhaps I too am guilty of this. I have discussions with a friend of mine from the reformed camp. And even though he is certainly open to ideas of our being "that generation," he leans more to a ten or twenty years + out view on end times. Because it just seems too much has to happen to process through the years to get to a more "official" end time scene in his mind.
Whereas I had mainly come out of an alarmist mindset (like when Mandella Effect made it big, I was wondering if we were in a deep fake tribulation waiting room of sorts). So over the years I have tended to extend my perspective out quite a bit. Back in 2017, I had thought that 2024 looked to be quite a marker year for end times proper. But even with my 1st seal view (which would include current events forming), I believe it could be years out before the tribulation. For me it would depend on what has transpired by July 2026 to see how close, "close," might be. My range now for rapture guestimation would be likely no earlier than mid 2026 (although that is because I believe the church is here for the 1st seal). But my views of course could be just as out of wack as any might be. The only constant I see there is that it would seem it certainly is going in the defenant direction I would have thought. But it is taking its darn sweet time about it. lol.
. . . . .
The main reason I would not hold to a gap theory of more than a few short months if that is in part theological. But the biggest theme for me in that is that my understanding of the Character of God would be such that He is more interested in the wicked not perishing. That they would repent. And that He would want as many souls to rapture as possible. That understanding of His great kindness, does not really afford me too much toward thinking that God would have a large gap leaving so many in a holding pattern toward the tribulation. So my biggest take on a gap theory or not would be God's character would not seem to be consistent with a gap. Or much of one. I mean if its a few months...maybe. But where I would detour from that is: How many babies are born a day? And how many people does that add up to over time? So I would look at that sort of thing kind of as a primary 1st order of whether it is best to even consider a gap theory.
I realize gap theories take the edge off of our trying to see too much in a moment. But my other concern is kind of close to my first. And that would be something like this: If God is wanting to testify to His word. And make His great power and truth of His word known to a world, it would seem a significant portion of that would be affording at a time where those who might be effected to notice, could still rapture. Otherwise we have vast occurances of prophecy coming together before a world that increasingly just faints in heart as things are revealed. And in a space where there is no out. Just trust in Him and hold on. Which will apply to some certainly at some point in time. Those in the tribulation. But I don't see God's character establishing a class of people to witness His great fulfillments in a vacuum. And again, on that note, it sort of comes back to the character of God. Showing off all his wonders before an audience that merely gets punked by it. Rather it would seem in full bloom and fruit that what is discernable about God's great wonders of unfolding prophecy, would be "primed" for a time where seeing them unfold be of moist intent from Him -- for more to be saved, repent, and not go through the tribulation.
When we typically look at it through an academic sense, we may not see so much as the moistness of God's tender heart as much as we might trying to line up trajectories that make theological sense of technical matches along the way. And in this sense, perhaps our maps and measures lean a bit more academic than the living loving factored in as much as the One who is running the show of it. I don't believe the wonders of prophecy unfolding, from the heart of God we know, would be for show. It would be for purpose. And the best purpose would likely be for a generation to escape a very unnecessary time to be here. I would imagine. I just mean that God seems to do what He does with as much deep purpose associated. As the Great I AM, it would not seem to be that God would put on a show of display in vanity. But in love. For those during the tribulation to repent (not just be wowed). And for those before the tribulation, to not have to face the horrors of it. For it is no intended living situation God would have purposed for His creation. But for His absolute need of judgement toward His creation.
So before going to what we understand the word is saying about technical fulfillment, I would see those above as far greater hermenuetics by which to see how everything might line up or not...in terms of a gap theory. In general this may not be as hard for me to consider as it might for some. I say that because since 2017, it would seem to me, as best as I can tell, that the 10 nation confederacy emerges during the tribulation. Our typical notions is to see it play out as an indicator of the tribulaiton. I don't hold to that view. This kind of hinges on how we see the AC being the 11th horn. Calibrating the 11th to = his covenant with the many. I don't do the math like that though. I believe the man of lawlessness is not the 11th horn necessarily. I believe the AC at the midpoint is the 11th horn.
If this sounds strange, I understand. But I did have several conversations of this with a brother on JDF for quite a while. We would go back and forth. But where we did tend to agree is that there are two AC positions. Same person. But two different uses of office.
1) The man of lawlessness who makes the covenant with the many
2) The supernaturally empowered AC demanding worship and the taking of the mark
We see this as the same person, but two different exercises of his role in the tribulation. So on that note I would the 11th horn to be a scriptural reference to ID the AC during that mid-point of the tribulation. Today's contemporary social moment views trend to see the 11th horn reveal and the revealing of AC as the moment he makes the covenant with the many. I don't hold that view. I don't think 2 Thes 2 is taking about the 11th horn reveal at the time of the covenant with the many. And when the man of lawlessness comes forth to make a covenant with the many, its not a revealing of antichrist. Its just a stop along the way. But today many pulpits hold that the AC is revealed at the covenant with the many. I believe by that time, the church is raptured. So who is he revealed to? The world won't get it. And if they did would that not cause a revival? And how could AC do anything if everyone has him pegged as the AC? Who is he then revealed to? The angels? Would that matter so much to us? The ones the word of God is written to? So I would think the intent of scripture there would affirm that the reveal (as further detailed in 2 Thes 2) is referring to his time of demanding worship making himself to be God. But that it would be the same one who much earlier makes a covenant with the many. But revealed not until he gains supernatural power (likely at the 5th trumpet and not before) Israel flees from him because of his midpoint mandates.
So its like I guess all those kind of govern an ideology for me that the gap theory is not that promiment in my view for those reasons. I hope that makes some sense. Blessings.
Ghoti Ichthus
Genesis 18:32, 2 Chronicles 7:14, Acts 5:29
It's after midnight, so another day closer to 
(or if God tarries and calls me home first)
EITHER WAY, another day closer to seeing my Savior!
(or if God tarries and calls me home first)
EITHER WAY, another day closer to seeing my Savior!
TCC
Well-known
Or did you mean a gap theory between the tribulation and Armegeddon? I ask because you quoted me in reference to my not being clear on how Israel goes from running from the AC to, "Ok, it's cool...we can go back to Israel now." So asking about a gap in relation to that quote might have implied between the tribulation and Armegeddon. If so, I apologize for missing that. But typically gap theories associated with tribulation timing and rapture (as you indicated I believe, was what you were asking--which is why I took it in the typical sense gap theories with tribulation are used) have to do with and downtime after the rapture but before the tribulation. I'm pretty sure that is what you meant. But in the event it was not...or also...then: Is Armegeddon post trib? Outside the 7 years?
Actually I don't think you are asking that. Because I think it is a pretty staple understanding that Armegeddon fits too nicely into the context of the tribulation. If it is 3.5 years to the midpoint and 3.5 years to the end point, then the Bible I believe does give us additional days to consider. I believe it is an additional 30, 45, or 75 days after. Like we could ask, are the events that occur in Armegeddon the days after the tribulation? The reapers angels. The supper of God. I really have not heard all that much about how best to place all that. I am sure there are some good studies on that. I just never made it that far. But however it might space out as, I believe it would not be beyond 75 days after the tribulation for us to get at the dividing of the nations on Christ's left and right in Matt 25. So in the event there is any spill over question of a gap in the tribulation aftermath, I believe there is no gap beyond whatever 70, 45, or 30 days might provide. Blessings.
Andy C
Well-known
I was referring to the time after the rapture, until the start of the tribulation. It could be mere minutes, days, weeks, months of even a year. I dont believe the OWG will be fully formed and a governing body until after the church is removed. I dont believe scripture indicates the final beast system can coexist with the church.
TCC
Well-known
I would tend to agree with that. Those who come to faith during the tribulation will come to realize I would imagine a whole host of things. I guess I would kind of look at that like, take today for example. How many say this person is the AC, or that person is the AC. How much more when it actually is. Only it would seem to be thought crazy I would imagine by the majority. I'm not so sure though about "quickly" though. Perhaps. But it might equally be a gradual process as well. I just leave that as a possibility too, because although we tend to peg the Danielism "too and fro" for today, I believe we are experiencing a hint of what that is in its fullness.
So like, I would imagine the full impact of Daniel "unsealed" will be at the midpoint (where it is most necessary to). But certainly a time approaching would catch quite a few also along the way I imagine. But I do believe the full "unsealing" as an act of God would be midpoint proper. Because it would seem because of the 144k's mission, they would be primed like that. Although, there is something else in that I might consider too. If the 144k are sealed from trumpets, the language used in seal 6 (falling like figs to the earth) to me, implies Israel figtree moment. And that it would seem there to be more likely a latter fulfillment of Joel "dream dreams and see visions" would apply to the period in time of the 6th seal that brings the 144k to a sealing of their own. And in this way, I would imagine an advanced supernatural eye opening experience of Daniel to accompany Joel 2:28. In this way it would seem that a remnant of the Jews get a partial awakening anew to Daniel ahead of a full unveiling of Daniel proper to the rest of the Jews and the world during the second half of the tribulation.
I also bring this up because seeing what we do in our day sometimes can seem like the book of Daniel opening up. Or a fulfillment of Joel 2:28. To that I would just say that I believe we are certainly entitled to a tap on the shoulder from on high pointing in this direction. But not to the extent of Joel 2:28 or Daniel unsealed. Likened to Acts 2, I believe would be the 6th seal timeframe. Because it is at that time the 144k would seem to be sealed. As well as a massive pouring out of His spirit primarily upon Israel (since it is their 70th week).
Because what our generation now is open to, and we compare this to earlier generations, I believe we do see a difference and might tend to superimpose things that the season we are now in lead to. But are not in full swing yet. I'd even go as far as to say one exclamation point on our age = the great number of Muslims coming to faith in Christ. Even to the point where many report Jesus being seen in their dreams unto conversion. To me, this is not Joel 2:28 proper. Nor an unsealing of Daniel proper. But in context, would appear to be an exclamation point of God towards His end game portion of partially hardening Israel. A point in time where "even" those from the Ishmael tribe of "those according to the flesh persecuting those who are according to the spirit" now come to faith in the Jewish Messiah even before Israel or the Jews do. In mass exodus from their Muslim roots. As amazing as this is to see, I would just understand this more as a likely closing act scene towards Israel very late day partial unbelief still lingering while it is still the age of grace. That would make a lot of sense to me.
. . . . .
I say this because there has been talk about Joel 2:28 occuring now. I had thought that in 2017. And I watched every night youtube rapture dream videos for a year straight. And saw them seeing things that were not or did not happen in relation--in short order. So I would just consider their dreams perhaps personal graces of God, but not to the across the board full throttle Joel 2:8 occurances. I have seen this belief in the church that latter Joel 2:8 fulfillment is for the church. But from what I have seen in the church overall, I would not consider personal graces or even insights from God upon the church today as Joel 2:8 esque. Because just as the fulfillment of the feast days being very real full bodied expressions of their referents (like the 1st 4 feast days being fulfilled in Christ and last 3 seemingly at His second return), I would think that Joel 2:8 and Daniel unsealed to have much greater obvious effect than how some might tend to see it today. No doubt as a generation to witness the hoodwinking of COVID might insist our age to be an age of super receiving from God (in contrast to such great illusion and deception). But I would see the 911/COVID factor to be a bar raised within the context of the age of grace experience. But in comparison to what had occurred prior. In contrast, yes there is a difference. But in comparison to what is coming in the tribulation age, we are merely stubbing a toe, is how I would frame that. As I would see the Mattewian 24 "many will be deceived" exclusive to the midpoint of the tribulation. But because of the great contrast of 911 & COVID scams upon humanity, we might tend to see those kinds of event so hugely different than the rest of age of grace history that we might tend to automatically parlay that into "many will be deceived" language in Matthew 24. Whereas, I don't think we have seen anything yet. And even so as things might become even more "out there," none of that would hold a candle to its most true and profound occurance in the tribulation. Its just that compared to what the age of grace has seen, we might tend to wholesale see things perhaps in exaggerated ways. Is my humble take on the matter in general. Blessings.
TCC
Well-known
Amen brother. I knew there were others out there that might also see this. Thanks for sharing that
Yet is there not like a billion % focus on all things beast system these days? Although I believe some good in notice can be helpful. But an over focus today on all things beast system related, to me, is a church fashioned blueprint. Not without some warrant. But it just makes too much sense to me biblically that the operating procudure would be in tandem with Romans 10 and 11. That with the church and Israel both occupy the same timeline, it would be Israel (beyond the views of the church as it relates to "her") as a way shower primarily, I believe. Or like the more we see things in reference to Israel more than a beast system blueprint, the more host of events connected can more soberly be aligned aright with trajectory and prophetic direction and import. This is one reason I believe the NWO will be taken down before our eyes. Because it will cause the church to have to backtrack and backpeddle an espoused blueprint of sensed importance.The One who is the spirit of prophecy is Christ (Rev 19:10). Not the church. And in loving patient pacing, it would seem we are alive at a time where God will be helping us to recalibrate that. All to His glory. Well that is my perspective. And I realize as we live in an age of huge convictions, that even the one I am stating here is also subject to this sort of thing. And may also be corrected...lol. I watched something for a short while this morning having to do with the Mandella Effect. Something I was introduced to YouTube by. And back then it was fascinating. But as I look at it now, what it seems to impart to me is: We are likely a generation with such import placed on our convictions that we are willing to believe science fiction rather than notice perhaps how our convictions had been mistaken. Well in any event, we do live in such an age. And it was kind of cathartic for me to watch this Mandella Effect update today. Becuase now looking at it, it makes sense how we might be a generation that perhaps insists in how we remember something. Rather than just consider we might be mistaken. Now I say that with a bit of caution. Because there are some unexplained things in Mandella Effect granted. But whatever that might be, is in no wise indicative that we are in some other universal timeline. But merely, tricked by our own certainty, likely. Blessings.
Well, if the church were separate from Christ, I could perhaps agree with your thinking regarding spirit of prophecy being the spirit of Christ. But since Christ is in His Church, literally in every member, there can be no separation of Christ and the Church. The Spirit of prophecy literally indwells His Church. There need be no consideration of the Mandela effect when we see what is written in Scripture, see what has and is taking place in the world, and compare the two.
Ghoti Ichthus
Genesis 18:32, 2 Chronicles 7:14, Acts 5:29
Last night while singing O Holy Night during the Christmas Eve service (Wednesday Church), I got the distinct impression it was the last Christmas Eve service.
Whether that applied to that church only, or to me being at that specific church, or persecution, or natural disaster, or I have no idea.
It was sad, really, because I can always feel the love and Christ's presence in that church.
Whether that applied to that church only, or to me being at that specific church, or persecution, or natural disaster, or
I have no idea.It was sad, really, because I can always feel the love and Christ's presence in that church.
You'll be going up with most of them there. You can have another hymn sing on the way up together as you spontaneously combust with sheer joy! And I'm willing to bet (what I have no idea) that you'll still enjoy hanging out together singing God's praises in your own corner of the choir. It'll be your gang, your bunch, and the love and Christ's presence will continue for eternity.Last night while singing O Holy Night during the Christmas Eve service (Wednesday Church), I got the distinct impression it was the last Christmas Eve service.
Whether that applied to that church only, or to me being at that specific church, or persecution, or natural disaster, or
It was sad, really, because I can always feel the love and Christ's presence in that church.
Andy C
Well-known
How close is the rapture?
Im now at a mental place where I don’t try and speculate when. For many years, in my studies in eschatology I would try and read between the lines of scripture to determine when. As predictable, all my previous attempts at guessing when failed.
Im very comfortable in believing we are in the final season, as the rapture can happen at anytime. I have no need to know when, but I will live everyday for the Lord, doing what I can to help others.
I will keep my eyes on Israel.
Im now at a mental place where I don’t try and speculate when. For many years, in my studies in eschatology I would try and read between the lines of scripture to determine when. As predictable, all my previous attempts at guessing when failed.
Im very comfortable in believing we are in the final season, as the rapture can happen at anytime. I have no need to know when, but I will live everyday for the Lord, doing what I can to help others.
I will keep my eyes on Israel.
TCC
Well-known
Amen. That is a great thing to consider. In some respects, however off charter some views in the church may be at times, there is a comfort that because Christ is in His church, it would not become as off course as Israel had gone during His first coming. That is a worthy notion to actually meditate on, amen.
As for the Mandella Effect, well, I would consider the majority of believers never getting caught up in that. I remember back in the early days of its forming, it caused no small storm on YouTube. And many believers were impacted by it (to small or greater degree). To the extend some very popular Christian channels this forum and JDF would approve of doctrinally had to iron out some ripples in the church in those days regarding the Mandella Effect buzz become a bit too much a concern in the body. Pound for pound pastor, I wholeheartely agree that the church have no need of Mandella this or that. But to trust in God's word.In 2017 I would watch YouTube videos on rapture dreams. Now, I am of the belief that God does not operate in the church today through dreams (well at least like He had in the 1st century). Even so, I keep an open mind and heart in how God might even impart some things to believers in our day. Yet, with a whole lot of safety railing. For instance, I do believe that Muslims who had dreams of Christ and came to Him is something God is doing in our age. But I have not studied it indepth. As I was watching though videos on rapture dreams I could see over the course of the year that the details in most people's dreams where not coming to pass. During that time though I did see a number of believers caught up in the Mandella Effect thing though. So I see that even though we be in Him, we still can be misled if we let ourselves.
When Paul wrote to the Corinthians, he addressed a lot of people that even though in Christ seemed to perform quite contrary. In Paul's letter to Galatia, he was puzzled even to the extent that some in the church were being bewitched. And at the end of the century, John's letter to the church had need to clarify quite a bit from the storm of gnostics who blew through town. So when I see these things in the word conveying to us a sense of the anatomy of the church, and the influences that can occur within His body even as He is in them, and if Peter could be led so far as to have need of Paul's rebuke on such concerns as even the gospel itself concerning Peter's behavior addressed in Galatians, we would never say that the spirit of prophesy living in the church would give context for us to fear the circumcision. Or be bewitched, or be acting like mere men (as in Corinth). But we have seen where all these things can be. Unfortunately.
In fact, even today do we not see tribalism as a huge pandemic within the church? Is the spirit of Christ that He is divided? For sure not. Yet, we have that condition before us. But on that note, where I would see a merging of ideas (yours and mine) would be something I would describe as this: John 15:15. To the extent we love one another in Him, is likely to the extent we will know what the Father is doing. However, the way I would understand Christ being the Spirit of Prophecy beyond the church is in that He transcends the church, and not us Him. When Macathur says from the pulpit, "Folks America is done," as he did 2 years ago, is that Spirit of Prophecy? Is that Christ in His church saying that? Or if the watcher world focuses a bit much on its understanding of how the age of grace morphs into the age of tribulaiton, will the themes it determines be as accurate as the word itself? If that were so, we should have been raptured in 1988. Because at that time the understanding of many in the church was that a biblical generation was a Western commercial idea of generation (40 years). And then I have seen too in the church some who would correct that by saying, "We should not even consider how the concept of generation works with Israel." Which could be accurate. But if we get the sense of the 4th generation coming out of Egypt as the Jews had, we know at least one place where "generation" seemed to have meant more than what was popular in Hal Lindseys hay day. And that the concept of generation thereafter could still mitigate out to 2048 in theory. So I just noticed in all that that there is a tendency in the church to use our reasoning in places considering perhaps it be on par biblically...and I am just saying...that does not have to be the case.
. . . .
As for the Spirit of Christ transcending the church, brother I believe i can prove this very easily. Even by something I fancy. But even so, I by no means affirm my perspective as the ultra right one. For my perspective may be as much in error as any view I might also not agree with. But for the sake of there being a true difference in that Christ most definitely does transcend the church, here is a fairly easy way to demonstrate. How is it that for 1800 years the church had thought the first seal in Rev 6:2 was a good judgement, while now in the 21st century most would consider the 1st seal to be the AC? And if so, where is the exegesis? Where is there one example in the Bible outside of Rev 6:2 that demonstrates a white horse as deception? Where in the history of any country or culture through the isles of time's cooridor do we find a white horse represent deception? It is in no culture. No history, and no other book or chapter in the Bible. It is a conclusion the church at large has agreed to see. With absolutely no exegesis whatsoever.
So like the most we have seen is: It can't be Christ so it must be antichrist. But that is not exegesis. That is preference. And look at how much a huge prophetic empire is built up on it. Is it possible that Rev 6:2 is the AC? Of course. Yes. Amen. It may well be. But the only thing that comes anywhere close to what even looks like exegesis is the presumption of how it fits with the one who makes a covenant with the many. And on that note I would say, yes that does approach the bench of exegesis. However, it is not really exegesis proper. It still represents a great guess. My point is how much of the church is sold on a guess as though it is something biblical. And to the extent it may be, Christ and His Spirit of Prophecy transcends that though, no? My views may not be correct on Rev 6:2. But I do have exegesis for it. And from how I might view it, it would seem quite a bit stronger because of the number of referents involved.
For example there is the charactor of God through the plethera of scripture. That alone might imply that one way to look at Rev 6:2 is a mirror of Christ, not being Christ, but perhaps a mirror element of Him. And the exegesis combo be that He comes on a white horse later Himself. And the closest compare would be something like a mirror not something as antithesis. But we would hold that God comes in judgement in the tribulation. And true this is. But in what way might this actually be argued? As I have had conversations with many in the past, some actually see Rev 6:2 as ominous. I believe it is the only 1 of the 21 judgements that is not clearly ominous. Perhaps this is a fancy of view. But I'm just saying on its face it does not look clearly ominous as every one of the other 21 judgements clearly do. So I just use this as an example where opinion can travel within the church as exegesis. For this Rev 6:2 case seems to be a pretty prime example though, to me at least.
Brother I am not saying that what the watcher movement might be tracking is not related to His movement within the body. I spent 4 years on JDF clearly to daily consider seeing outside my own little views. Because I am aware of God being present in all His church. And open to where those on JDF might inform me otherwise (John 15:15). To this day I am swayed, but even so after 4 years, still swayed to be very open to other considerations akin to some JDF perspective. Which often lines up with the NWO view in the watcher world -- that this NWO globalist empire we see now is the same that will lead to the tribulation. I believe there is still room to consider that. I do believe that ship is sailing though. But yet for now I am still open. And I would not be if it were not true the Spirit of Christ be among His people. But we are finite and often prone to error. Whereas Christ would transcend all that. And it is possible that Christ adjust the church's end time vibes. As equally as He might with this one posting this too. What I would not see though is that since Christ is in His Church, He has made the church an end time prophet or having extraordinary ability in some office of end time prophecy determinors or even discoverors perhaps even. It is no doubt the church will see some things for sure, amen. But the emphasis I would place on how it could is in a John 15:15 motif. Where we strive toward a deep sincere love and understanding of one another's perspectives and differences. And in that the answers that could become most clear come from the most robust place of our walking in John 15:15 principles. But in general, what seems to be happening in the body dynamic in no small places, tends to be an askewement--a tendency of each camp triples downing on its views...which in some ways can be rather contrary in scope of a John 15:15 principle whereas 2020 spiritual vision be most activate, likely...because in that place Christ is most realized in His body. And the eye of the body be most clear. Well, just saying. Just wanted to clarify if helpful. Blessings.
TCC
Well-known
I'm with you brother. When it didn't happen on 9-23-2017, I was like..."Ok...now what?" lol. So in heart and in spiritual stride yeah I too have somewhat settled in as well dear brother ....amen.
But as adverse to the other post I recently made here, and this is just my take, my sense I get...not based on exegesis but overall mood. Although in principle I understand why we call the rapture a signless event or even that the rapture is imminent. The doctrine of imminence could be a thing. At least from our perspective. We won't likely know. So in that sense it would be correct that since we don't know, it could be anytime. I believe Paul understood it could anytime. But I don't necessarily see his observations as always one's that form doctrines. I guess in the Paul sense, I would see it more like an attitude of expectation and eagerness toward God...which would be doctrinal...amen.
But like I think, "Could the rapture have been in 1947?" I suppose it could have been. But for some reason God wanted the church here when Israel returned on the scene. So in that sense I would say, no the rapture could not have occured before 1947, because It would seem that God wanted the church here when He brought Israel back. I guess since some of my views can be off the beaten path, mind as well go for broke here...lol. But I hope taken in the spirit of playful fun in adoring our great God either way. But I do have a view that has been forming in me over the years to kind of mitigates away from rapture immenancy and more and more to an obvious time.
I know a statement like that might be anamathma in a way. I don't mean it as such though. I just kind of think a lot in terms of irony. Like "If I were to think the most ironic, what might that look like?" And in one way it would look like: No secret rapture, no imminent type rapture, but a rapture clearly coming on the horizon. Yeah, like how might that work? I dunno. I'm not saying it is like that. I just over the years have been leaning more toward a potential of the irony of that I recken.
So like this is how I would qualify that: "If certain chain reactions occur on our horizon...THEN...with each passing day...Irony might just be a superhero." So I kind of look at it poetically I guess? lol. Not sure how to describe that. But this is my vibe currently. Since God waited for Israel to return before rapturing the church...WINK/WINK, then it would seem that too to be also potentially a "TELL." And if a tell, then perhaps a very super loud obnoxious one. One that would be unmistakeable to the generic sober thoughts. Ok, so if it sounds off already, just go with it for a sec.
Ok so like what if the fact that Isreal is here now is a huge TELL of rapture timing? Like a shoulder nudging us? If true AND a chain reaction occur (and only if a chain reaction occur would I permit myself to have this much leash)? The chain reaction being: America becomes more powerful in rule of law and constitution, Israel becomes much stronger, Abraham Accords strengthen, and the NWO tank. If we see all these things occurring it would not occur in a vacuum. It would occur in direct contradiction to the vibe of the beast system and the path paved by a late spirit of AC in our portion of last days affair. So if that kind of chain reaction goes off...I would think the "season" of the rapture would be "peace and security" in massive proportion over Isreal. If the chain reactions lead to that...AND we see that....I would say that would be a massive rapture bang zone. And who would clue us? The church blueprint? Nope. Israel. And that is so Romans 10 and 11...it would surely be upon the wings of poetic irony.
But yeah, if the chain reaction does not go down like that...um...ok...so like...never mind. I'll be over in the corner putting pepper and sauce on me crow wings (like chicken wings). And i'll be sure to have an empty stomoch because there will be plenty of crow to eat. Blessings.
Spartan Sprinter
Well-known
Crow wings??? Wait.....I'm with you brother. When it didn't happen on 9-23-2017, I was like..."Ok...now what?" lol. So in heart and in spiritual stride yeah I too have somewhat settled in as well dear brother ....amen.
But as adverse to the other post I recently made here, and this is just my take, my sense I get...not based on exegesis but overall mood. Although in principle I understand why we call the rapture a signless event or even that the rapture is imminent. The doctrine of imminence could be a thing. At least from our perspective. We won't likely know. So in that sense it would be correct that since we don't know, it could be anytime. I believe Paul understood it could anytime. But I don't necessarily see his observations as always one's that form doctrines. I guess in the Paul sense, I would see it more like an attitude of expectation and eagerness toward God...which would be doctrinal...amen.
But like I think, "Could the rapture have been in 1947?" I suppose it could have been. But for some reason God wanted the church here when Israel returned on the scene. So in that sense I would say, no the rapture could not have occured before 1947, because It would seem that God wanted the church here when He brought Israel back. I guess since some of my views can be off the beaten path, mind as well go for broke here...lol. But I hope taken in the spirit of playful fun in adoring our great God either way. But I do have a view that has been forming in me over the years to kind of mitigates away from rapture immenancy and more and more to an obvious time.
I know a statement like that might be anamathma in a way. I don't mean it as such though. I just kind of think a lot in terms of irony. Like "If I were to think the most ironic, what might that look like?" And in one way it would look like: No secret rapture, no imminent type rapture, but a rapture clearly coming on the horizon. Yeah, like how might that work? I dunno. I'm not saying it is like that. I just over the years have been leaning more toward a potential of the irony of that I recken.
So like this is how I would qualify that: "If certain chain reactions occur on our horizon...THEN...with each passing day...Irony might just be a superhero." So I kind of look at it poetically I guess? lol. Not sure how to describe that. But this is my vibe currently. Since God waited for Israel to return before rapturing the church...WINK/WINK, then it would seem that too to be also potentially a "TELL." And if a tell, then perhaps a very super loud obnoxious one. One that would be unmistakeable to the generic sober thoughts. Ok, so if it sounds off already, just go with it for a sec.
Ok so like what if the fact that Isreal is here now is a huge TELL of rapture timing? Like a shoulder nudging us? If true AND a chain reaction occur (and only if a chain reaction occur would I permit myself to have this much leash)? The chain reaction being: America becomes more powerful in rule of law and constitution, Israel becomes much stronger, Abraham Accords strengthen, and the NWO tank. If we see all these things occurring it would not occur in a vacuum. It would occur in direct contradiction to the vibe of the beast system and the path paved by a late spirit of AC in our portion of last days affair. So if that kind of chain reaction goes off...I would think the "season" of the rapture would be "peace and security" in massive proportion over Isreal. If the chain reactions lead to that...AND we see that....I would say that would be a massive rapture bang zone. And who would clue us? The church blueprint? Nope. Israel. And that is so Romans 10 and 11...it would surely be upon the wings of poetic irony.
But yeah, if the chain reaction does not go down like that...um...ok...so like...never mind. I'll be over in the corner putting pepper and sauce on me crow wings (like chicken wings). And i'll be sure to have an empty stomoch because there will be plenty of crow to eat. Blessings.
