What's new
Christian Community Forum

Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

What Do You Guys Think About This Sense Upon "Decree?"

TCC

Well-known
This 30 minute video is fascinating. Overall the way this guy tried to understand how his discovery makes sense today seems rather off. But the consideration of “decree” implies that perhaps the rapture is potentially slated in 2027? A theory. And i have heard this “decree” reference before…but not like this. What do you guys think?


Blessings.
 
Using the Galillean wedding structure as a guide, the Father tells the Son it's time when it is time, and not before.

Given that, other than to say we're in the season or I think it'll be soon, I believe it's a fool's game to try and frame a date or an approximate date or even a year for the Rapture.

When the Father sees that the Son has properly prepared for the Bride He'll tell the Son it's time, and from that point the Bridegroom won't waste any time fetching His Bride.

That said, I really can't blame a person for trying to pick a time frame for that blessed event that we all so anxiously await.

I'm at church right now. I'll try to remember to peek at the video when I get home later today.
 
I watched the video. The part about Sultan Suleiman was interesting but overall I'd say watching wasn't time well spent.

Studying the presentations of the 'End Times Berean' is probably the antithesis of what a true Berean should be doing with regards to studying the Word and endeavoring to understand the Truth.
 
Haven't watched the video.
But on first glance, I'm never impressed with people who want to share what we "missed" and then proceed with a "defenite" date.
Yes i hear you sister. I pass on fanfare and hype like the plague. But i am kind of a sucker for some intrigue just ta keep it interesting...lol. From what i understand this is also a position Missler held. And from the sound of it this person does not know that. So it seems to have come to him independently. What is marginally noteworthy is that the Egyptian duplication of the Great American Eclipse starts in 2027. So there is that ticklish doodad. I'm just throwing it out there for comment. I was thinking 2024 would be the year because of what we will likely be exposed to this Fall. But then Ez 38 seems like it is a very important pointer. And so maybe my views on the 1st seal travel better in tandem with Ez 38. But now that looks delayed too. I am just trying to kick up dust while we wait. :) Thanks for your reply dear sister. Blessings.
 
What do you guys think?
I did take the time to watch this video and also researched more into another longer video of his.
To be blunt, I wouldn't invest too much time into his teachings.
Though he seems to be knowledgeable, articulate, and have a gentle demeanor in regards to what he is presenting, I believe he is stretching scripture way out of its properly understood context and is misusing and misapplying certain passages to fit his narrative.

Now in fairness, my opinion of his teaching is based more off the other more lengthy video that was posted a couple of weeks ago though the one you posted was enough to cause pause.
A few of areas where I completely disagree with him is his misapplication of Daniel 11:29-31 and
Matthew 24:15-20 for example.

First off I completely disagree that we are currently experiencing any part of the 7 year tribulation. He goes to great lengths to try and make a compelling argument that we are currently near the midpoint, that the commonly accepted by most pre-trib scholars and teachers understanding regarding the timing of the decree of the temple being built and the Messiah being cut off has been misinterpreted, and his wrenching apart of the events of the taking away of the daily sacrifice and the abomination of desolation in Daniel 12:11 is unwarranted IMO.

He starts with Daniel 11:29-31 and then goes into Matt 24:15-20 and Daniel 12:11 as if they are all describing the timing of the same event. The Daniel 11 passages are describing an already fulfilled prophecy concerning Antiochus Epiphanes while the Matt. 24 and Daniel 12 verses are speaking of a yet future fulfillment about the man of sin himself.

Now of much more concern is his beliefs that 2020 (Trumps Abraham Accord) started the 7 year countdown of the tribulation, the Oct. 7 attacks on Israel fulfill much of the "taking away of the daily sacrifice"(Hamas' purpose for the attack was to stop the sacrificing of the red heiffers) and the abomination of desolation is actually the dome of the rock and it's proximity to the past temple that stood there. He uses Ezekiel 43:8 as his proof text for that one.

Now he did use several other current events relating to 2020 and Oct.7 in the teaching he is putting forth but I don't want to list all of those as I believe he is in great error and I would not recommend any believer, pre-trib or otherwise, to use him as a resource.
 
I watched the video. The part about Sultan Suleiman was interesting but overall I'd say watching wasn't time well spent.

Studying the presentations of the 'End Times Berean' is probably the antithesis of what a true Berean should be doing with regards to studying the Word and endeavoring to understand the Truth.
Thanks for checking it out brother and giving it your take. Blessings. :)
 
I did take the time to watch this video and also researched more into another longer video of his.
To be blunt, I wouldn't invest too much time into his teachings.
Though he seems to be knowledgeable, articulate, and have a gentle demeanor in regards to what he is presenting, I believe he is stretching scripture way out of its properly understood context and is misusing and misapplying certain passages to fit his narrative.

Now in fairness, my opinion of his teaching is based more off the other more lengthy video that was posted a couple of weeks ago though the one you posted was enough to cause pause.
A few of areas where I completely disagree with him is his misapplication of Daniel 11:29-31 and
Matthew 24:15-20 for example.

First off I completely disagree that we are currently experiencing any part of the 7 year tribulation. He goes to great lengths to try and make a compelling argument that we are currently near the midpoint, that the commonly accepted by most pre-trib scholars and teachers understanding regarding the timing of the decree of the temple being built and the Messiah being cut off has been misinterpreted, and his wrenching apart of the events of the taking away of the daily sacrifice and the abomination of desolation in Daniel 12:11 is unwarranted IMO.

He starts with Daniel 11:29-31 and then goes into Matt 24:15-20 and Daniel 12:11 as if they are all describing the timing of the same event. The Daniel 11 passages are describing an already fulfilled prophecy concerning Antiochus Epiphanes while the Matt. 24 and Daniel 12 verses are speaking of a yet future fulfillment about the man of sin himself.

Now of much more concern is his beliefs that 2020 (Trumps Abraham Accord) started the 7 year countdown of the tribulation, the Oct. 7 attacks on Israel fulfill much of the "taking away of the daily sacrifice"(Hamas' purpose for the attack was to stop the sacrificing of the red heiffers) and the abomination of desolation is actually the dome of the rock and it's proximity to the past temple that stood there. He uses Ezekiel 43:8 as his proof text for that one.

Now he did use several other current events relating to 2020 and Oct.7 in the teaching he is putting forth but I don't want to list all of those as I believe he is in great error and I would not recommend any believer, pre-trib or otherwise, to use him as a resource.
Thanks AnyMinute for the detailed feedback. I appreciate your deduction and consideration and also how you rule out. Yeah if it were for the general overall way he is looking at things, i'd run...lol. Good points on Daniel 11 and Matt 24. I would agree. I think there is enough bad connections with scriptures actually for me to be a little embarrassed. For this not the way i do bible research. But my focus would be on Daniel 9:25 and how well established it had been fulfilled.

What i have gotten used to over the years is that there are likely things that resonate within things that don't. In military terms it would be distinguishing the signal from the noise. Or like true prophesy coming from Balaam. Or true prophecy coming from Caiaphas John 11:51-52. Not that i believe there are prophets today. I don't. But most pastors that are sound will say something scripturally inaccurate. As far as i can tell. I think its part of being alive. So i expect wrong info. But I try to see if it can be indicative of something else (if something might have merit to it in another way like...if that makes sense?).There is not much we can do with it. To me the crux would be like how accurate is it that it is well understood that plaza and moat may not have been included in the first time. If that is heavy then it would leave open something later. To me that point would be most important whether it is something to consider or not.

Well thanks for taking the time to watch and reply with such detail. Its appreciated :) Blessings.
 
I would like to thank all who took time to look into this. And apologize in a way because as the dust clears I can see a few things from the content creators book. In generally I was asking our trusted forum if there might be something to this potential second countdown from the 1500s. Based on the level of confidence coming from the content creator in how he described it. But I have found some faulty reasoning which had I been aware of at the time I would have never troubled our dear forum. So thanks again for weighing in here guys. It is rare I run with some strange fire football (other than the mother load one on my 1st seal...which has problems...but is also not without solutions as well). So just saying thanks. And moving on. Thanks for so graciously helping me to move on here :) Blessings in advance. Here is where I believe I am landing the plane on this one...

1. I searched to discover in commentators a concern that plaza and moat (should this even been the exact language used in the original) had not been included in the postexelic period. As I searched and searched I never found a hint of discrepancy. So went to see if the content creator had a list or notes included in his show notes. He did not. But did have his book. According to his own words in his book...

"Artaxerxes’ decree restored the rule of law and administration,and it recognized Jerusalem as the city of God (Ezra 7:15-19).That’s not far off, but what of the specific mention of “plaza” and“moat?” Well, those two words, plaza (rechob – Strong’s h7339)and moat (charuwts – Strong’s h2742) are not mentioned in eitherdecree by Artaxerxes. However, the rechob of the House of God ismentioned in Ezra 10:9, when all the tribes of Judah and Benjaminassembled there to discuss their intermarrying with foreign wives.I think the case can be made that a plaza (rechob) was indeedrestored under the first decree of Artaxerxes because they were allable to meet there—since it was at that time already usable as a128 J. Paul Tanner. "Is Daniel’s seventy weeks prophecy messianic? Part 1."Bibliotheca Sacra 166, no. 662 (2009): 181-200. SEVENTY WEEKS HAVE BEEN DECREED || 135meeting place. In this case, it is reasonable to conclude that whenArtaxerxes decreed that they could also do whatever else theythought best with the rest of the gold and silver, “according to thewill of your God,” a wide door was opened by this first decree.As a result, we have a solid base for inferring that the initialrebuilding of the temple by Ezra also included improvements tothe plaza (rechob) of the Temple."

So like right there he admits in his book what he concludes the opposite of in his video...lol. Sensationalizing.

2. Gap Theory -- The content creator states that there is not necessarily a gap between week 69 and 70. And although this could be thought of as a reasonable concern, the content creator inadvertently has his own creation of a gap theory too without explanation in stating his adversity to gap theories. Now he may explain this somewhere, I forget. But if according to the content creator Jesus fulfilled a sense of the 70th week...what do we have from AD 33 to the 1500s? How is over 1400 years to the next "decree" according to the content creator not a gap itself?

3. I then found in his book that he is in support of seeing the 6 seals in Matthew 24. Someone who considers that to be exegesis, to me, is not being honest with themselves. Or at least realizing that if the term "exegesis" is applied to some form of method by which to see the 6 seals in Matthew 24, there are equally (and in my observation) far greater more robust exegetical models challenging the 6 seal Matt 24 "theory." At best it is a hypothetical "theory." And typically, to me, a way for learned men to point to a "look what I found" theological parlor room trick.

4. Is alot like 1. If the content creator explained in his book alternative to what he sensationalizes in his video...there is something deeply wrong with that. That social artifact is evidence of knocking many legs out from underneath the ideology because at best all it is doing is trying to grab for land when drowning.

. . . . .

The difference I would see with something like this and 9-23-17 as a potential Rev 12 sign and Scotty Clark changing his own mind about it (which is similar to writing a book seeing clearly that moat had originally been built and then saying there was great question about it in scholarship) is that I don't see anything to hang the 2nd decree on other than "maybe it mirrors the 2 comings of Christ." Which is, to me, a similar approach to the 24 elders in heaven insistence of rapture prior to the first seal. For it does look like Rev 4 does mirror a rapture. How far can we extenuate the concept of "mirror" can be a great exegetical question. The 24 elders are not without other epxlanation, but admittedly, they are a weak spot in my 1st seal notion (unless we rapture very soon). But the Rev 12 potential in 2017, for me, seems to fit a category in time when prophesy did get fulfilled (along the way) with the same year affirming Jersusalem as Israeli capital in 2017. And the category in time where we have seen for years a slew of events amplifying "something very strange is goin' on ya'll." For me Rev 12 sign a links well with Rev 12 sign b (red dragon) as they both seem to relate to a c celestial sign in Rev 15. So to me, the strength of a Rev 12 sign 2017 potential rests more so in its potential continuity with scripture itself (if my Rev 12/15 views holds water). But I don't see anything substantial to hang a 2nd degree on biblically. So all we have is an historical event with weird events occuring near 2027. That is not really enough to move my interest. But I thank you guys for being open and caring to help sort out this issue with me.

Again, blessings. :)
 
He ended up in the YouTube suggestions in my feed so I clicked on him and within a few minutes I figured he was more than a bit off and turned him off. Then I saw this here, but others have given a better answer and @TCC has come to the right conclusion about him as well. Just chiming in to agree.

Unfortunately a soft spoken, gentle demeanor can actually hide a really bad set of teachings.

In fact that's one of Satan's best strategies.

Walk and talk like a lamb, get mistaken for a lamb but slip in some poison. Not enough to raise suspicion, just enough to get them hooked and intrigued. Save the really bad stuff for later when they are dazed and confused but still remembering there was some good teaching in there.

It's not the outright screaming heretics that suck the flock in, it's the nice gentle foxes like Osteen for example. He's a really nice guy. Really soft spoken, gentle and kindly. Humble even. But his pulpit is one of the premier ways that the prosperity gospel is making it's way into the church right now. Living your best life, NOW!!!
 
I would like to thank all who took time to look into this. And apologize in a way because as the dust clears I can see a few things from the content creators book. In generally I was asking our trusted forum if there might be something to this potential second countdown from the 1500s. Based on the level of confidence coming from the content creator in how he described it. But I have found some faulty reasoning which had I been aware of at the time I would have never troubled our dear forum. So thanks again for weighing in here guys. It is rare I run with some strange fire football (other than the mother load one on my 1st seal...which has problems...but is also not without solutions as well). So just saying thanks. And moving on. Thanks for so graciously helping me to move on here :) Blessings in advance. Here is where I believe I am landing the plane on this one...

1. I searched to discover in commentators a concern that plaza and moat (should this even been the exact language used in the original) had not been included in the postexelic period. As I searched and searched I never found a hint of discrepancy. So went to see if the content creator had a list or notes included in his show notes. He did not. But did have his book. According to his own words in his book...

"Artaxerxes’ decree restored the rule of law and administration,and it recognized Jerusalem as the city of God (Ezra 7:15-19).That’s not far off, but what of the specific mention of “plaza” and“moat?” Well, those two words, plaza (rechob – Strong’s h7339)and moat (charuwts – Strong’s h2742) are not mentioned in eitherdecree by Artaxerxes. However, the rechob of the House of God ismentioned in Ezra 10:9, when all the tribes of Judah and Benjaminassembled there to discuss their intermarrying with foreign wives.I think the case can be made that a plaza (rechob) was indeedrestored under the first decree of Artaxerxes because they were allable to meet there—since it was at that time already usable as a128 J. Paul Tanner. "Is Daniel’s seventy weeks prophecy messianic? Part 1."Bibliotheca Sacra 166, no. 662 (2009): 181-200. SEVENTY WEEKS HAVE BEEN DECREED || 135meeting place. In this case, it is reasonable to conclude that whenArtaxerxes decreed that they could also do whatever else theythought best with the rest of the gold and silver, “according to thewill of your God,” a wide door was opened by this first decree.As a result, we have a solid base for inferring that the initialrebuilding of the temple by Ezra also included improvements tothe plaza (rechob) of the Temple."

So like right there he admits in his book what he concludes the opposite of in his video...lol. Sensationalizing.

2. Gap Theory -- The content creator states that there is not necessarily a gap between week 69 and 70. And although this could be thought of as a reasonable concern, the content creator inadvertently has his own creation of a gap theory too without explanation in stating his adversity to gap theories. Now he may explain this somewhere, I forget. But if according to the content creator Jesus fulfilled a sense of the 70th week...what do we have from AD 33 to the 1500s? How is over 1400 years to the next "decree" according to the content creator not a gap itself?

3. I then found in his book that he is in support of seeing the 6 seals in Matthew 24. Someone who considers that to be exegesis, to me, is not being honest with themselves. Or at least realizing that if the term "exegesis" is applied to some form of method by which to see the 6 seals in Matthew 24, there are equally (and in my observation) far greater more robust exegetical models challenging the 6 seal Matt 24 "theory." At best it is a hypothetical "theory." And typically, to me, a way for learned men to point to a "look what I found" theological parlor room trick.

4. Is alot like 1. If the content creator explained in his book alternative to what he sensationalizes in his video...there is something deeply wrong with that. That social artifact is evidence of knocking many legs out from underneath the ideology because at best all it is doing is trying to grab for land when drowning.

. . . . .

The difference I would see with something like this and 9-23-17 as a potential Rev 12 sign and Scotty Clark changing his own mind about it (which is similar to writing a book seeing clearly that moat had originally been built and then saying there was great question about it in scholarship) is that I don't see anything to hang the 2nd decree on other than "maybe it mirrors the 2 comings of Christ." Which is, to me, a similar approach to the 24 elders in heaven insistence of rapture prior to the first seal. For it does look like Rev 4 does mirror a rapture. How far can we extenuate the concept of "mirror" can be a great exegetical question. The 24 elders are not without other epxlanation, but admittedly, they are a weak spot in my 1st seal notion (unless we rapture very soon). But the Rev 12 potential in 2017, for me, seems to fit a category in time when prophesy did get fulfilled (along the way) with the same year affirming Jersusalem as Israeli capital in 2017. And the category in time where we have seen for years a slew of events amplifying "something very strange is goin' on ya'll." For me Rev 12 sign a links well with Rev 12 sign b (red dragon) as they both seem to relate to a c celestial sign in Rev 15. So to me, the strength of a Rev 12 sign 2017 potential rests more so in its potential continuity with scripture itself (if my Rev 12/15 views holds water). But I don't see anything substantial to hang a 2nd degree on biblically. So all we have is an historical event with weird events occuring near 2027. That is not really enough to move my interest. But I thank you guys for being open and caring to help sort out this issue with me.

Again, blessings. :)
Yeah a lot of these guys have all the confidence and calmness in the world and may even throw in the occasional " Hey don't take my word for it , read God's word to back up what i'm saying" almost as if they are trying to call a bluff with that line.

But like Margery says, the Holy Spirit will usually sound the alarm bells off pretty quickly with a majority of these guys
 
He ended up in the YouTube suggestions in my feed so I clicked on him and within a few minutes I figured he was more than a bit off and turned him off. Then I saw this here, but others have given a better answer and @TCC has come to the right conclusion about him as well. Just chiming in to agree.

Unfortunately a soft spoken, gentle demeanor can actually hide a really bad set of teachings.

In fact that's one of Satan's best strategies.

Walk and talk like a lamb, get mistaken for a lamb but slip in some poison. Not enough to raise suspicion, just enough to get them hooked and intrigued. Save the really bad stuff for later when they are dazed and confused but still remembering there was some good teaching in there.

It's not the outright screaming heretics that suck the flock in, it's the nice gentle foxes like Osteen for example. He's a really nice guy. Really soft spoken, gentle and kindly. Humble even. But his pulpit is one of the premier ways that the prosperity gospel is making it's way into the church right now. Living your best life, NOW!!!
Well said dear sister. From the camps i have come out of, "smooth" and "biblically accurate" were the bread and butter. So so hard to see clarity with such solid normalcy. Even now as i look back, it wasn't just close to majestic. It seemed to discover how to sow the not just synthetic majestic into the human court. But learn well and close its mirror, its scent, its very understandable language even. I am acquanted. And yes, seems to have come of age like a good wine. Or...

blessings.
 
Yeah a lot of these guys have all the confidence and calmness in the world and may even throw in the occasional " Hey don't take my word for it , read God's word to back up what i'm saying" almost as if they are trying to call a bluff with that line.

But like Margery says, the Holy Spirit will usually sound the alarm bells off pretty quickly with a majority of these guys
Amen. And it is a great blessing to have such a sound forum to not only have cover, but to be able to truly be ourselves in our phase of learning. Like our Lord...a light burden, and easy yoke. Sweet.

From reading some of his book, it would seem he means well. And is excited i believe for what he sees to discover. The deception i guess would in my understanding be in the human condition. It is good to be reminded and warned though that in a day when the internet and social media have become the oracle of "the genuine," for we see genuinness is something to also have come of age in our day. Even so, the enemy's playground would likely be what is closest to the heart. Thanks for your gracious and caring feedback. Blessings.
 
Back
Top