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Perfection, when will we gain it?
- Thread starter Hobie
- Start date
One who continues in sin will be out of fellowship with Him, but loss of salvation is not possible for those in Christ.
We can say we are In Christ, but do we crucify the flesh as Paul says, and then continue in sin and the desires and lusts thereof...?
Galatians 5:24
And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.
Matthew6:33
Set your face like flint - Isaiah 50:7
Look at the scriptures for yourself.
Does Lot not offer up his daughters to sodomites in Sodom to protect others? Did he not follow the lust of his eyes to live in that city?
Yet 2 Peter 2:7 states he is RIGHTEOUS.
Because it is by faith we are justified and made righteous, not by works lest any man should boast
Matthew6:33
Set your face like flint - Isaiah 50:7
I am not saying it is good to sin. But sinning has nothing to do with your salvation. Salvation is by faith.
Sanctification on the other hand determines your growth and your rewards.
Completely different things.
Sanctification on the other hand determines your growth and your rewards.
Completely different things.
Andiamo
Hanging on to the Throne
We don’t crucify our own flesh. Our flesh is crucified with Christ at the moment of our belief…our faith and trust in Him.
From Galatians 2:
I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me. 21I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness come by the law, then Christ is dead in vain
AnyMinute
Well-known
1 Corinthians 6:10-11
10nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor verbal abusers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God. 11And that is what some of you were. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified, in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.
It seems like what you really want to argue against is the security of the believer and the assurance of salvation. We have all tried to point you in that direction with these posts.
I believe SDA doctrine denies eternal security and relies heavily on proving ones faith by works and obedience.
Are you open to the possibility that a born again believer can trust in the fact that they are saved and can rest in the finished work of Christ?
Yes, so we must truly be IN Christ, not just claim we are, and He will judge.
Its clear what Gods Word says..
2 Corinthians 5:10
For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.
Andiamo
Hanging on to the Throne
You asked me this question upthread, but I think you need to find this for yourself.
Tell us how one is truly IN Christ, and back up what you say with scripture.
Take your time.
His work of redemption, now comes the judgement. Its clear what Gods Word says..
2 Corinthians 5:10
For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.
1 Peter 4:17
For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?
2 Corinthians 5:10
For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.
1 Peter 4:17
For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?
Kem
Well-known
Since I am not a Greek scholar, I will defer to Got Questions.org.
"To crucify the flesh is to obey the call to Christian discipleship. It means losing our life to find it in Him (Matthew 10:39). As we daily put to death the sinful nature, we begin to walk in victory over the flesh. Conquering the flesh is what Paul describes as walking in the Spirit: “So I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh” (Galatians 5:16)."
Notice that putting to death the sinful nature is a daily thing, not a once and done. As we Walk by the Spirit. again a continuing thing rather than a once and done. Do we win every battle with the flesh? no otherwise we would not need Jesus at all. Do we strive with our fleshly desires, yes indeed we do!
The judgement seat, also called the bema, is for rewards or lack thereof. It doesn't remove us from heaven where this judgement will take place but rather determines our position of service.
AnyMinute
Well-known
TETELESTAI
That judgment is for works not for salvation. We are fully saved by what Christ did; but whether we receive rewards in heaven or not and the amount of the rewards is what is determined at the Bema seat judgment.
10 According to the grace of God having been given to me, as a wise master builder I have laid the foundation, but another is building upon it. But let each one take heed how he builds upon it. 11 For no one is able to lay another foundation, besides the one being already laid, which is Jesus Christ. 12 Now if anyone builds upon the foundation using gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, or straw, 13 the work of each will become manifest, for the day will disclose it, because it is revealed in fire, and the fire itself will prove the work of each, what sort it is. 14 If the work of anyone that he built up will remain, he will receive a reward. 15 If the work of anyone will be burned up, he will suffer loss; but he himself will be saved, but so as through fire. (1 Corinthians 3:10-15)
Note particularly verse v15.
Over the years I've preached a number of sermons on this and related topics. This area is very important to understand properly. There is, sadly, such a thing as a carnal Christian. You're probably not interested in reading sermons; but in case you are, here is the text of three that deal with this area--
Losing Salvation
Failure To Thrive
Carnal Christians
Carnal Christians: Is There Such a Thing?
The Carnal Christian: Is There Such a Thing? Lot is an excellent way in which to illustrate this topic. Here was an adult man who chose to accompany Abram to Canaan. He also left his people, his friends, his society, and every other thing he had—both in Ur and Haran—and headed off into the...
www.raptureforums.com
Andiamo
Hanging on to the Throne
I am Italian and can relate. I used to be like
Mt Vesuvius. I am much better now but can still snap once in a blue moon.
In the 6th grade my physiology teacher was Italian. When he would lose it I was always afraid he'd have a heart attack. His inability to control himself was his legacy for me... that's all I remember about him.
Spartan Sprinter
Well-known
We had a greek Geography teaecher or head of the Geography department and that man loved yelling and putting the fear of God into people>
LOL i fondly remember one day he was marching up the hallway looking in each classroom even though it was not related to any of his classes giving a menacing look into each room hoping to catch some kid misbehaving or clowning so he could barge in and tell off the student
LightOfMyLife
Well-known
sealed until the day of redemption. 
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