Faith Without Works Is Dead

[Andy C]

One of the main arguments against the doctrine of eternal security to those who don’t understand it is that its opponents believe it is a ‘license to sin’.

Salvation is a three step process. First, one must recognize his condition as a sinner. Secondly, that person must recognize that Jesus paid the penalty for that sin on the Cross. And third, that sinner must repent and be converted;

“Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord.” (Acts 3:19)

When one repents of one’s sin and trusts Jesus, then the Scripture says one becomes ‘a new creature’. “. . .old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.” (2nd Corinthians 5:17)

Repentance means more than mere sorrow or regret or despair or grief over sin. Bible repentance means a change of mind toward God that results in a change of action.

Writes Robert Girdlestone in “Synonyms of the Old Testament”;

“Repentance is neither sorrow without change or change without sorrow, but it is such a deep feeling of sorrow as gives rise to a determination to change.”

“Faith Without Works is Dead”

“Faith Without Works is Dead” Vol: 44 Issue: 5 Thursday, May 5, 2005 “Faith Without Works is Dead” One of the main arguments against the doctrine of eternal security to thos…

omegalettercom.wordpress.com

 

[Matthew6:33]

- first in

 

[Goodboy]

Repentance means more than mere sorrow or regret or despair or grief over sin. Bible repentance means a change of mind toward God that results in a change of action.

I would agree with this thread except for the change of action part. The repentance spoken of is to change ones mind and agree with God. Meaning we acknowledge that we are a sinner which is really the first step. James was speaking to saved Christians and was motivating them onto action. His point was these Christians were saying how much faith they have in their Christian walk, but doing nothing. The faith required for salvation is Totally Free and requires nothing except belief. After you are saved your faith is then tested and rewarded and this faith requires action on our part.

John 6:29 Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.

Here are some things that I wrote that explains what I have stated further.

Faith & Works

Faith & Works (Christian Student) In the Bible James states that faith without works is dead. Do you agree? (Me) Yes I agree that faith (meaning belief) is in fact dead without works (meaning action). (Christian Student) But wait a minute; didn’t you state that salvation was a free gift and...

christiancommunityforum.com

The Book of James

The Book of James Objective of The Book of James: To stir up the Church into action. This message was not a message on salvation, but a message to stir up “saved” brothers and sisters in the faith, into action. However, James does use examples of what is required for salvation, as he states...

christiancommunityforum.com

 

[Goodboy]

Repentance means more than mere sorrow or regret or despair or grief over sin. Bible repentance means a change of mind toward God that results in a change of action.

One reason people come up with additional requirements to what it takes to gain the FREE GIFT of salvation is sometimes due to their personal testimony. According to what was stated you must have sorrow, regret, despair and grief over sin and change your actions. All of that sounds good and noble, but does that sound anything like a FREE GIFT?

Not saying that this is why this was stated, but many times people assume that what they went through is what everyone that gets saved will go through. When God saved me I did not do any of the things stated as true repentance. Over time yes I grew and became a doer not just a hearer, but I was already saved.

God did show me that at one time I was using my personal experience regarding salvation to tell others what would happen to them. When I got saved God did it in a way that I have never ever doubted. I did not realize at the time that it was just how God saved me. So when sharing the Gospel I would tell those I was speaking to once saved they would never doubt the Gospel or their salvation. How wrong I was!!! I later discovered that many Christians that I knew were saved sometimes doubted the Gospel and/or their salvation. God (the Holy Spirit) then asked me where in the Bible does it say once saved one would never doubt the Gospel or their salvation?

Just my two cents.

 

[Andy C]

It took me a few times of reading this long OP to fully grasp his message. I liked it so much, I bookmarked it on my IPAD back in 2019 when it was posted on RF.

IMO, this is probably the best article I have read on this subject.

I encourage all to read the entire post.

I will up Goodboy, and offer this is just my 3 cents…

 

[Goodboy]

IMO, this is probably the best article I have read on this subject.

Andy I know you totally agree that salvation is a FREE GIFT, so why do you now post something that speaks to what someone has to do?

 

[Andy C]

Andy I know you totally agree that salvation is a FREE GIFT, so why do you now post something that speaks to what someone has to do?

Perhaps you did not read it all?

Either way, its a keeper in my book.

 

[Andy C]

Andy I know you totally agree that salvation is a FREE GIFT, so why do you now post something that speaks to what someone has to do?

The OP never states salvation is not a free gift, but does state it is a free gift. There is a disconnect somewhere Between what he wrote and what you wrote

 

[Goodboy]

Perhaps you did not read it all?

No I did not read it all. What was stated in the thread was enough for me to know I don't need to read it all. I don't read everything that Christians write for this reason below.

Ephesians 4:14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;

 

[Goodboy]

The OP never states salvation is not a free gift, but does state it is a free gift. There is a disconnect somewhere Between what he wrote and what you wrote

I won't keep going back and forth with you but he defines repentance as something one must do, which is works. I will leave it at that and let all decide for themselves.

 

[Andy C]

I won't keep going back and forth with you but he defines repentance as something one must do, which is works. I will leave it at that and let all decide for themselves.

How can you have salvation without repenting - which means means turn to Him?

 

[Kaatje]

No I did not read it all. What was stated in the thread was enough for me to know I don't need to read it all. I don't read everything that Christians write for this reason below.

Please read the whole article, Goodboy.
You will be pleasently surprised!
I love most of Pete Garcia's articles, but this one stands out.
Thanks for posting it, @Andy C.

 

[Hol]

How can you have salvation without repenting - which means means turn to Him?

Maybe I can raise it to 4-cents?

When I got saved God did it in a way that I have never ever doubted. I did not realize at the time that it was just how God saved me.

Ditto, and it isn't a common experience I've found out too.

There was a day when I was home alone sweeping my kitchen and I sensed our Heavenly Father's call, or drawing: Jesus said "No one can come to Me, unless the Father who sent Me draw him: and I will raise him up on the last day.'' (John 6:44)

I wasn't saved for several months later (was confused, studying Buddhism & weird stuff) BUT, I knew I was loved by my Creator.

The day I understood it was Jesus and the entire Bible is true, I turned to Him. There was no first step of recognizing my sin. God disciplined me within days of my conversion, and I had never read the Bible, so needed strong discipline to both nudge me into depending on His grace, and He reassured me that He loved me.

Sorrow and grief over my sin would hit me daily once I began studying my Bible.

Anyhow, my added 1-cent is that not every first step in following Jesus is recognition of sin.

 

[Hol]

From the article: "Repentance, as it relates to salvation, means to turn to God from sin. It means to bow before Jesus Christ as the God of one’s life."

Check my avatar: God saved you by His grace when you believed

I did not turn from sin, I simply put my faith in God. He supplied grace and the Bible became my lifeline, showing me my sin and mostly His Goodness!

 

[AnyMinute]

I've read through it twice now and I appreciate the post. Pete did a very good job outlining many truths in a brief article. The second read was not only to try and see Goodboy's perspective but also to chew on a part that first struck me wrong. I won't mention that part yet because I want to make sure I didn't read more into it than was intended.

From my layman's perspective, he didn't go into all the nuances of a deep theological dive that would be required to fully develop his article on repentance and salvation. That would require a 12 part, 1.5 hour long sessions of an Andy Woods teaching seminar.

Kidding aside,I actually noticed that he didn't make the distinction and differences between justification and sanctification very well, if at all. We all know that justification occurs that one moment in time when we place our faith alone, in Christ alone, and His finished work of the cross, for He is the propitiation of our sin 1 John 2:2. We are sealed at that moment, being indwelt by the Holy Spirit, until the day of our redemption Ephesians 1:13-14. For us, that will occur at the rapture when we are glorified.

In his overview of explaining repentance and justification which most understand as salvation, it gets a little blurry when the distinction isn't made between the work of Jesus at the cross, and the work of sanctification (also worked out in us/ for us by Jesus). That process is lifelong and there will be a marked difference in your life as we continually yield our mind and flesh to Him. Pete did a good job of explaining that no matter how unnoticed by others or even ourselves, there are indeed changes.

So all 3 tenses of salvation, our Justification, our Sanctification, and our Glorification, are all provided because of Jesus.

1 Corinthians 1:29-31
…29so that no one may boast in His presence. 30It is because of Him that you are in Christ Jesus, who has become for us wisdom from God: our righteousness, holiness, and redemption. 31Therefore, as it is written: “Let him who boasts boast in the Lord.”…

He truly has done it all!

 

[Goodboy]

Please read the whole article, Goodboy.
You will be pleasently surprised!

As per your and Addy's (I meant to say Andy's) request I scanned through the article. Sure as you stated, I was pleasantly surprised at what he later stated, which was that the repentance during salvation was "A Change of mind" not a change of action. But the first part contradicts the second part of the article where it defines repentance required for salvation as follows.

"Repentance means more than mere sorrow or regret or despair or grief over sin. Bible repentance means a change of mind toward God that results in a change of action."

This statement can make someone that is not saved think they cannot do all of that. It can also make a saved Christian think they are not saved if they did not do all of that. I should also point out that he uses his own experience to make his point which we must be cautious with. I did that when I was first saved, until the Holy Spirit asked me where in the Bible does it state that.

Why am I so, so adamant about not giving even the slightest hint of works to salvation? Because while I was exposed to Christianity all of my life, I did not get saved until I was 28. Why? Because I did not think I could do what I was told was required to be a Christian. When I finally was told by a brother that it was a FREE GIFT and all I had to do was believe and accept it, I was like well I can do that!

What is Satan's primary goal? To keep people from getting saved correct? I believe his secondary goal is making Christians question their salvation, which will make them ineffective in sharing the Gospel.

I stick by my first response.

 

[Andy C]

Please read the whole article, Goodboy.
You will be pleasently surprised!
I love most of Pete Garcia's articles, but this one stands out.
Thanks for posting it, @Andy C.

Agree.

Lots of good comments on this thread, I appreciate them all.

Nuff said…..

 

[Andy C]

As per your and Addy's request I scanned through the article. Sure as you stated, I was pleasantly surprised at what he later stated, which was that the repentance during salvation was "A Change of mind" not a change of action. But the first part contradicts the second part of the article where it defines repentance required for salvation as follows.

"Repentance means more than mere sorrow or regret or despair or grief over sin. Bible repentance means a change of mind toward God that results in a change of action."

This statement can make someone that is not saved think they cannot do all of that. It can also make a saved Christian think they are not saved if they did not do all of that. I should also point out that he uses his own experience to make his point which we must be cautious with. I did that when I was first saved, until the Holy Spirit asked me where in the Bible does it state that.

Why am I so, so adamant about not giving even the slightest hint of works to salvation? Because while I was exposed to Christianity all of my life, I did not get saved until I was 28. Why? Because I did not think I could do what I was told was required to be a Christian. When I finally was told by a brother that it was a FREE GIFT and all I had to do was believe and accept it, I was like well I can do that!

What is Satan's primary goal? To keep people from getting saved correct? I believe his secondary goal is making Christians question their salvation, which will make them ineffective in sharing the Gospel.

I stick by my first response.

I think we both agree one has to repent before we can be saved, and that salvation is a free gift. Repent by turning to Him, and by turning to him you believe He is the Savior, and you are saved!

Who is Addy?

 

[Goodboy]

Repent by turning to Him, and by turning to him you believe He is the Savior, and you are saved!

If what you stated is your definition of repentance then yes I totally agree!
However the article said that repentance was as repeated below.
"Repentance means more than mere sorrow or regret or despair or grief over sin. Bible repentance means a change of mind toward God that results in a change of action."

"Who is Addy? "
That is a good question, who is Addy? I guess I need to do a better job of proof reading what I write! LOL!

 

[Andy C]

If what you stated is your definition of repentance then yes I totally agree!
However the article said that repentance was as repeated below.
"Repentance means more than mere sorrow or regret or despair or grief over sin. Bible repentance means a change of mind toward God that results in a change of action."

That is a good question, who the heck is Addy? I guess I need to do a better job of proof reading what I write! LOL!

Lower down in the article, he gave a more detailed of what is not, and what is repentance, which I think is excellent. I do not believe he implied repentance is a work.


Edit - We can disagree, but I dug through all your posts, and on Nov 14 you told me “Are you really going to examine every line of what I write? Or can you just go with my main point?

It was a good point you made!